Broken Bat - Baseball Forum: Nobody elected to the Hall of Fame

Forum >> Baseball >> Nobody elected to the Hall of Fame

Post ID	Date & Time	Game Date	Function

#2434	01/11/2013 6:50:49 am
Mig2012 Joined: 09/26/2012 Posts: 547 Inactive	Yeah, it’s complicated to judge if these players deserve to be recognized for what they accomplished in their careers. Steroids, like any other performance enhancer drug has to be forbidden from sports, so even if in the steroids era it wasn’t in the rules that they couldn’t be used, their use is still morally condemned because it’s definitely a way of cheating the game. However, it seems that the steroids use was a widespread thing at the time, so you have to wonder if there really was any advantage gained by its use over the competition. From that perspective one could compare the steroid era to the dead ball era, when pitchers were doing all those kinds of things to the ball that later were forbidden. It could be regarded as cheating as well, and some of those pitchers are in the Hall of Fame.

#2436	01/11/2013 3:49:10 pm
tc_ferdzz Joined: 11/13/2011 Posts: 135 Inactive	and it's been said (by a former pro player mind you) that even with steroids...for Bonds to accomplish the numbers that he did is still an amazing feat of skill and athleticism...but no one will think that way...it'll always be "he juiced"... by the way...was he ever proven guilty???...i think i just sort of stopped following the story...but i don't think i ever heard that he was actually proven "without a doubt" guilty...it's just that no one believed him innocent anymore

#2437	01/11/2013 4:59:35 pm
Solana_Steve Joined: 03/10/2010 Posts: 123 Inactive	Wikipedia on Bonds BALCO scandal Since 2003, Bonds has been a key figure in the Bay Area Laboratory Co-operative (BALCO) scandal. He was under investigation by a federal grand jury regarding his testimony in the BALCO case, and was indicted on perjury and obstruction of justice charges on November 15, 2007.[138] The indictment alleges that Bonds lied while under oath about his alleged use of steroids.[139] In 2003, Bonds first became embroiled in a scandal when Greg Anderson of the Bay Area Laboratory Co-operative (BALCO), Bonds' trainer since 2000, was indicted by a federal grand jury in the United States District Court for the Northern District of California and charged with supplying anabolic steroids to athletes, including a number of baseball players. This led to speculation that Bonds had used performance-enhancing drugs during a time when there was no mandatory testing in Major League Baseball. Bonds declared his innocence, attributing his changed physique and increased power to a strict regimen of bodybuilding, diet and legitimate supplements.[140] During grand jury testimony on December 4, 2003,[141] Bonds said that he used a clear substance and a cream that he received from his personal strength trainer, Greg Anderson, who told him they were the nutritional supplement flaxseed oil and a rubbing balm for arthritis.[142] This testimony, as reported by Lance Williams and Mark Fainaru-Wada, has frequently been misrepresented. Later reports on Bonds' leaked grand-jury testimony contend that he admitted to unknowingly using "the cream" and "the clear".[140] In July 2005, all four defendants in the BALCO steroid scandal trial, including Anderson, struck deals with federal prosecutors that did not require them to reveal names of athletes who may have used banned drugs.[143] Perjury investigation and federal indictment On November 15, 2007, Bonds was indicted on four counts of perjury and one count of obstruction of justice as it relates to the government investigation of BALCO.[144] On February 14, 2008 a typo in court papers filed by Federal prosecutors erroneously alleged that Bonds tested positive for steroids in November, 2001, a month after hitting his record 73rd home run. The reference was meant instead to refer to a November 2000 test that had already been disclosed and previously reported.[145] The typo sparked a brief media frenzy.[146] His trial for obstruction of justice was to have begun on March 2, 2009, but jury selection was postponed due to 11th-hour appeals by the prosecution.[147] The trial commenced on March 21, 2011, in U. S. District Court, Northern District of California, with Judge Susan Illston presiding.[5] He was convicted on April 13, 2011 on the obstruction of justice charge, for giving an evasive answer to a question under oath.[6][7] His sentence did not include prison and an appeal is pending.

#2438	01/11/2013 5:03:36 pm
Solana_Steve Joined: 03/10/2010 Posts: 123 Inactive	I don't think he's ever admitted it (a la Lance Armstrong), but he did get convicted of obstruction and is now appealing. Steve

#2439	01/11/2013 7:09:43 pm
Utah Dodgers Joined: 10/21/2012 Posts: 49 Inactive	I heard Goose Gossage on the Jim Rome show today and he flat out said that if any of those players are elected into the HOF it will be a huge black eye for baseball and it will just say that it is ok to cheat as long as you do well while cheating it is ok. He was very against these players and kept calling them cheaters through out the interview. Myself i kind of agree with him and it is cheating, Do these records that were broken mean anything to any of you guys or do they have a huge asterisk next to them. All athletes fade as they age it is the way life is you get older you slow down and lose your abilities now take a look at Bonds in the early 90's compared to his last 5 years he changed dramatically his head was the size of a beach ball and his skills pretty much stayed the same so to me he was very obvious with the steroid use and it is cheating and cheating is not allowed. Mig hit on some great points which has me thinking more on this useless topic...

#2446	01/12/2013 5:20:08 pm
Mig2012 Joined: 09/26/2012 Posts: 547 Inactive	Hehe, sorry about that.

#2639	02/01/2013 4:45:19 pm
Boomstick Joined: 10/10/2012 Posts: 4 Inactive	The only travesty in the HoF voting was Craig Biggio not getting elected. Guy was a class act, and deserved it first ballot. I know Im late, but im still angry about it lol

#2641	02/01/2013 5:05:17 pm
admin Joined: 01/27/2010 Posts: 5024 Administrator	Here’s where I think the steroid era really hurt some guys. In Biggio’s case, he hit 291 home runs which is real close to 300 HR’s which used to be one of those baseball magic numbers. Now, 300 doesn’t seem like a lot of home runs anymore because you have these steroid abusers that were hitting 40, 50, 60 home runs a season and 300 seems pretty commonplace now. I think it also hurts him because if you look at the MVP voting in his career, he never finished higher than fourth. But if you threw out all the “enhanced” performances, he might have finished a lot higher in some of those seasons. I’ve always like Biggio too. He represents more of an old-school type player that wasn’t just a masher. He was flexible (playing multiple “difficult” defensive positions over his career) and could hit, hit for power and run. Also, I kind of like those guys who played for only one team. Basaeball-Reference has his HOF chance at 68%. Hope he makes it. Steve

#2642	02/01/2013 11:02:36 pm
Erkuza Joined: 05/08/2012 Posts: 137 Inactive	I'm not so sure Biggio was clean. I'm sure that was the thought process going into the voters heads. He was teammates with Bagwell and Caminiti. I know Bagwell has no evidence on him, but he has the body of some one who was on the juice. But if I had a vote, I would vote in Bonds, Clemens, Sosa, and Palmerio in a heartbeat.

#2644	02/02/2013 10:59:54 am
thevinster Joined: 10/25/2012 Posts: 22 Inactive	The hall of fame is a museum. Electing Bonds, Sosa or any other steroid user does not justify what they did. Instead it should acknowledge what they did and if that means they get a little section or something separating them from the clean players then so be it. Not putting them in the hall of fame is like ignoring that they ever played.