Broken Bat - Discussion Forum: Blown Saves

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Post ID	Date & Time	Game Date

#86592	02/02/2022 8:57:50 pm	Sep 8th, 2053
admin Joined: 01/27/2010 Posts: 4985 Administrator	I've received a few questions about blown save over the years. I think the logic is valid, but I thought I'd ask. It seems people are alarmed by early inning blown saves (appearances that wouldn't normally result in a save, unless the pitcher closed out the last 5 inning). Anyway, I found this example online: Oakland Athletics at Texas Rangers Box Score, May 11, 2010 Zeigler blows a save in the 6th inning. Thanks, Steve

#86594	02/02/2022 9:46:24 pm	Sep 8th, 2053
Rock777 Joined: 09/21/2014 Posts: 9600 Haverhill Halflings III.1	Not saying the logic is wrong, but the blown saves in that game come in the 7th inning. Near as I can tell a save can happen in any of three situations: pitcher enters the game with a lead of no more than three runs and pitches for at least one inning pitcher enters the game with the potential tying run either on base, at bat or on deck pitcher pitches for at least three innings. So if any of those are true, it would be a save attempt. If the pitcher surrenders the lead during a save attempt, they earn a blown save. I think most of us get fixated on the "tying run" clause because that is the most common situation for a Closer. I'm not certain how the third clause is supposed to work. If a guy comes in in the 6th and then is pulled after two innings, they "could" have been in for three. If they are in for three, do they record the blown save? This is probably the clause causing us confusion. I don't believe you can score a save in coming in in the 5th, because if a pitcher comes in in the 5th inning they have a win attempt. A pitcher can not record a win and a save in the same game. So if its a win attempt, its probably not really a save attempt? Its seems like a bit of a void in the rules, near as I can tell... But it doesn't seem like it is possible to score a save if you come in in the 5th inning. Interestingly, although it is impossible for a pitcher to score both a win and a save in the same game. It is possible to score a win and a lose in the same game. Updated Wednesday, February 2 2022 @ 9:58:38 pm PST

#86597	02/03/2022 12:16:37 am	Sep 8th, 2053
atomic Joined: 12/05/2012 Posts: 82 Sunnyvale Rebels II.2	Here's an interesting read I've found: https://tht.fangraphs.com/the-unofficial-rules-of-holds-and-blown-saves/ And the game where Robertson gets in during the 3rd inning and earns a BS: https://www.baseball-reference.com/boxes/NYA/NYA201710030.shtml To me personally, I'd say it's o.k. to score a BS in early inning cases. The other option would be to establish a new stat category called Blown Lead for such relieving situations until the end of the 6th inning or so.

#86598	02/03/2022 1:57:00 am	Sep 8th, 2053
AssumedPseudonym Joined: 10/26/2016 Posts: 1130 Deerfield Beach Rats V.7	Rock and I had a brief discussion about that one a few years back. Neither of us like it, but it’s kinda hard to argue with MLB.com.

#86603	02/03/2022 2:24:50 pm	Sep 8th, 2053
Rock777 Joined: 09/21/2014 Posts: 9600 Haverhill Halflings III.1	I hadn't thought about the situation where a 3rd pitcher comes in before the 5th inning. The first reliever gets the win opportunity, so the third guy in is still a save opportunity (weird as it seems to get a save in the 3rd inning).

#86605	02/03/2022 3:54:23 pm	Sep 9th, 2053
Geech Joined: 01/12/2014 Posts: 545 San Luis Obispo Turtles IV.8	Early blown saves are consistent with my understanding the of the stat. I think it's fine.

#86614	02/03/2022 10:42:04 pm	Sep 12th, 2053
Ken_Kennilworth Joined: 11/26/2019 Posts: 400 Charleston Hawks II.1	changing focus on blown saves (sorry for the highjack) is leading the division in blown saves a bad thing? after all, you have to be ahead to blow a save...and in my league, the two standings leaders in both divisions also lead in blown saves...oddity, or not?

#86622	02/04/2022 8:50:43 pm	Sep 16th, 2053
Rock777 Joined: 09/21/2014 Posts: 9600 Haverhill Halflings III.1	I would say blown saves plus a good record likely means that you have good starters, poor middle reliefs, and a good offense. So not good from the perspective of you pen strength.