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Pig_Cola
Joined: 09/15/2013
Posts: 1445

Glendale Marshals
II.1

Broken Bat Baseball
I agree with newtman with that assessment of the player you linked wickersty. I also think that he would have a lot of control, but no out pitch to be effective.
amalric7
Joined: 01/20/2016
Posts: 2235

New York Lancers
IV.2

Broken Bat Baseball
On the other hand, I think you've done quite well. newtman and PC are absolutely correct, but I'm looking from the perspective that you need to get younger first and foremost, and need guys that can get through multiple innings.

That guy has no out pitch but at 14 POT (even with low SI at age 27-28) he'll move fast - a ton of starts and innings will see his SI "fly" up towards the range for a 14 POT (which is 112-119). The results might not be pretty to begin with, but pitchers who have made slow gains through the minors can gain from 15-35 SI in a single season. His ERA might sit around 5.00 but so what? By the following season he should be much more effective, and 2-3 effective seasons when you're rebuilding can be reward enough. Other guys to look for are 12-13 POT pitchers with low fielding numbers and an out pitch - major-league or better fastball, exceptional breaking ball, that kinda thing. But those guys tend to be popular - as the old saying goes, you can never have enough pitching.
wickersty
Joined: 05/11/2017
Posts: 1002

Deadwood Perambulators
II.1

Broken Bat Baseball
Thanks amalric7,

With your thoughts in mind, one of the guys I've been keeping bookmarked but am not sure if I'm correct, is Leonardo Oviedo.

Scouting Report: He can have a major league slider. His control will always be below average. He will have the stamina to be a starting pitcher. He has good overall potential.

Decent SI at 25 y/o. 13 POT. One out pitch, plus probably some good CoS. Low defense. I *think* this is exactly the kind of guy I need to find. What do you think?

I sort of feel that a lot of the time, I'm going to have to accept one or even two things that I'm not "in love with" about a guy -- otherwise, he'd probably not be on the waiver wire. This guy Oviedo has below average control. I'd be hoping major league slider, 13 POT, low defense, decent starting SI and starting pitching skill levels will outweigh the below average control and make him a viable starter.



Updated Friday, July 14 2017 @ 3:46:06 pm PDT


Updated Friday, July 14 2017 @ 3:51:00 pm PDT
boltsman
Joined: 04/18/2017
Posts: 109

Eden Prairie Wolves
II.1

Broken Bat Baseball
I am not that high on Leonardo Oviedo because he has quite a few question marks.

He is a lefty, and those are easier to find.

His current skill is not great, which means your result will suffer if you try to play him in the majors.

He will be 26 next season, and I think it will be hard for him to reach his 13 potential.

Besides the obvious pickups, I would even prefer someone like Martin Bouchard over Leonardo Oviedo. I think Martin Bouchard can at least get to 12/14/12/12/14 because he is more developed now. The stats are still not great, but as an example of players without any interest, I think he will be better than what Leonardo can offer.

Interestingly enough, I find Octavio Valdivia (I was one of his ex'es) to be similar to Martin Bouchard. Octavio is a righty and has a higher ceiling, which makes him a better choice though.

Updated Friday, July 14 2017 @ 6:04:00 pm PDT
wickersty
Joined: 05/11/2017
Posts: 1002

Deadwood Perambulators
II.1

Broken Bat Baseball
Thank you again.

If I'm being too annoying feel free to just stop replying, and I'll stop asking ;)

So the assumption, after hearing from you guys, is that I'll need to spend a couple seasons amassing more prospects and close-to-majors ready youth, I'm looking to keep or sign young guys that are good fielding/arm/range (with the occasional DH exception) with good hitting/PD/BC potentials so that I can get them up to the big club in a season or two and give them lots of playing time, allowing for my team to suck for a couple seasons.

Can I now ask about my own feeling on one of my current prospects?
Ralph Turner is a 20 year old SS that I drafted this year in the 8th round. I thought he was a real good find, but now that I'm reviewing him more I'm thinking he might be a borderline cut, to make room in my minors for better FA/Waiver signs and next year's draft.

My thoughts are:

Pros:
"Good" Hitter
"Outstanding" Fielder
SI at decent level for age

Cons:
Low Range
Low Arm
Meh Speed

Also, I assume that his BC will be ok but his PD will be crappy?

So now I'm feeling like he's a cut to make room for better FA/Waiver/Draft additions?

amalric7
Joined: 01/20/2016
Posts: 2235

New York Lancers
IV.2

Broken Bat Baseball
Hey, ask all the questions you like, we enjoy sharing our 'wisdom' - just don't take it as gospel!

boltsman makes a good argument, but I'd still pick Oviedo over Bouchard for two simple reasons: an out pitch, and higher POT. If they reach minimum SI for their respective POT their lines might look like this:-

Oviedo: 10/14/16/10/15
Bouchard: 10/16/12/11/15

Not a lot of difference there, but with just average fastballs you want the 16 Movement slider over the CoS. Plus Oviedo' CoS and Mov have more room to grow. You can get away with below average control in LLVI and LLV.

As to Turner, looks like a decent player on the surface but your assessment is accurate. A lefty-hitting SS/3B is a useful guy to have on your roster, given that most 2B/3B/SS are righties. But that 12 POT doesn't help him, and even though the speed is good enough I doubt his bat plays well enough to make him anything other than a reserve. There is a chance he maxes his POT and perhaps even pops to 13 POT, but the latter is unlikely and in the former case you're looking at a best outcome (103 SI) of 15/13/9/9/13/17/14/13 - still a decent reserve but probably not a starter, and that's IF he maxes out. I'd probably still keep him around and see how he develops.

I'd cut Ricci, Borrego and Clemons from your minors though. Guys who are wild or lacking in control are no-nos: I've seen guys lacking control have some hot streaks (usually against me) but more often than not they'll hurt you. As I said before below-average control is okay lower down, but it'll kill you the higher you go. Avoiding walks is hugely important.
wickersty
Joined: 05/11/2017
Posts: 1002

Deadwood Perambulators
II.1

Broken Bat Baseball
Thanks again. I'm glad to hear I was on the right track about Turner. And as far as Ricci, Borrego and Clemons, I'm also glad that I seem to be getting the hang of this... I'd marked Borrego and Clemons as cuts, but had been on the fence about Ricci.

Thanks again, this is immensely helpful.
wickersty
Joined: 05/11/2017
Posts: 1002

Deadwood Perambulators
II.1

Broken Bat Baseball
Would love to run another example by you guys, if you don't mind. Now - a guy like this one...

He's only 27, which means he might have another year or two of SI increase. And he's a 15 Potential with awesome arm and range.

But he appears to be horrifically stunted and misused, and his current offensive ratings are pretty crap.

My verdict he's he's a lost cause and not to be touched, and it's a shame he never got to be the player he could have been.

Agreed?

Thanks

Jeff
amalric7
Joined: 01/20/2016
Posts: 2235

New York Lancers
IV.2

Broken Bat Baseball
Yeah, he is a lost cause. I had him on my team but gave up after just over a season because he never looked like panning out, slow development that was taking too long. If he had been played full-time in the majors after he left me he might have made some good gains, but that never happened. Pity.
FurySK
Joined: 02/07/2015
Posts: 299

Inactive

Broken Bat Baseball
He's a 13 potential OF with probably 13/16/11/11/16 approach if you give him two seasons of full time.

potentially a useful player, but he's not ever going to become a 14/15. I'd take him if i gutted a team of 33+ year olds that i inherited 4 seasons ago, but for 98-99% of the teams out there i'd call him a no-touch candidate.


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